(007) Snowbound 4: The Inn of Madness

[DAMAGE]

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x105/ShatteredCovenant/clueode.jpg

This is a Custom Variant game of Snowbound Ed2. The rule extension is as follows: private communication among the living is permitted in addition to public communication. This is not a game of Tactics.

These are the registered participants.

[H]DMG
[1]Z
[2]Gio
[3]KM
[4]BC
[5]SP
[6]Llama
[7]JJ
[8]Chef
[9]DoC
[10]?

[Z]

I'm in! ;)

[Gio Takahashi]

I'm in.

[Killer_Man_]

I'm in.

[Bloodcinder]

Estoy en.

[SpaceProg]

Why not? *joins*

[llama_egg]

I'm in...

...

As long as people stop kicking me out. I'm running out of relatives from different dimensions D:

[Jasmin Jaquine]

I'm up for it again!

[Bloodcinder]

I'm up for it again!
Keep in mind Snowbound is not what you played last time. You played Crystal Valley.

[Jasmin Jaquine]

Oh was it? Wait, which one is going on right now? *Will have to go look*

Yeah! Massive confusion actually. I had wanted to get in on the Snowbound game, but got caught up with stuff IRL so sat out. But I do want to play Snowbound.

[Bloodcinder]

Cool. Yes, it's Snowbound (Revelations) now. I think you'll like it more than CV.

[Gio Takahashi]

What variation of snowbounds will we be playing, if any?

[Killer_Man_]

I think revealtions makes the game a bit too easy. Cause you always assume there is at least 1-3 killers based on how many are playing. So really it's just a chuck and guess situation.

[Bloodcinder]

I think revealtions makes the game a bit too easy. Cause you always assume there is at least 1-3 killers based on how many are playing. So really it's just a chuck and guess situation.
Fail. It's exactly the same as the regular game except you have more information.

That said, I don't think DMG is playing Revelations and I hope he doesn't.

[Gio Takahashi]

I think revealtions makes the game a bit too easy. Cause you always assume there is at least 1-3 killers based on how many are playing. So really it's just a chuck and guess situation.

I dunno, Snowbound Revelations allows you to use the killed victims to your advantage, whether you expelled them or they were killed by the killer, you will know their role, and if they're not a killer, then they have to be telling the truth and you can use them as clues to identify possible killers prior to their death.

I really don't think we were able to use it quite effectively in the last game.

[Killer_Man_]

Fail. It's exactly the same as the regular game except you have more information.

More information = much easier game.

-.-;

[Z]

With certain strategies implimented, Revelations can be very difficult but this is the first time we played so everyone was still getting used to the advantages and disadvantages. I'd imagine the next Revelations game will play out a bit differently (most notably, I expect much quicker decisions regarding expulsions now that we know how much death can help the cause whether that's killing an innocent or a killer in this variation).

[Gio Takahashi]

More information = much easier game.

-.-;

Yes and no. You only know the roles of the dead. Something that killers can use as well to identify people based on their role as well.

[Z]

What variation of snowbounds will we be playing, if any?

:qft:

I think he already said he didn't like the Assassin Variant and the only other one voted up as much in SB3 was Revelations.

That just leaves Standard SB, Haunting, Tactics or Revelations again.

Haunting may be difficult to host (which is why I opted not to yet) and Tactics will enable the private communication, making it similar, but not the same, to CV. And most of us are already familiar with Standard and Revelations now.

[Killer_Man_]

I would rather play standard or rev if we have to pick again.

[chefTENGU]

I'm in, of course.

[Bloodcinder]

More information = much easier game.

-.-;
You said it turned the game into guesswork. It's decidedly less guesswork than the regular game because you have more information.

[Face of the face you just made, only moar.]

[Z]

http://wizards.com/dnd/images/aprilfools_pony1.jpg?

[Bloodcinder]

Exactly.

Oh, and I'd like to play Tactics.

[DAMAGE]

I am thinking of either normal or tactics.

[Bloodcinder]

Tactics for the win!

[DAMAGE]

Tactics should make things really interesting.
Also Thanks Z for the image I added in the first post. =p

[Z]

I think I'm gonna double pimp that image and put it in the Odes album, too, hehe. I may alter it a little later and add some of the backgrounds of the original images to give it more of an authentic "I cut these faces from photographs and taped it on this box" feel, hehe :D

[deathofcheese]

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x105/ShatteredCovenant/clueode.jpgPWN-YOUR-FACE EPIC

I'll sign up for both of the open slots. That picture has inspired me to do awesome things. Like own face.

;)

[llama_egg]

I don't see my face D:

[Gio Takahashi]

That's because you never posted your picture

[Bloodcinder]

If we're voting, I'm definitely voting for Tactics.

[Gio Takahashi]

I'm not a big fan of tactics, but I'll try everything. Personally I'd like to try all variation of snowbound at least once.

[SpaceProg]

Eh, surprise me. I'm a master of rolling with punches and stuffs.

[Bloodcinder]

So, DMG, is this one technically called "Snowbound 4" or "The Snowbound Inn of Madness"?

[Gio Takahashi]

I think we need to create some sort of name formating like:

OOC/IC - Game #00X - Mafia Y #Z

Also KM gave me an idea in IM few days ago to make an archive specifically for mafia, since we're going to vault a lot of those anyway.

[Bloodcinder]

On the archive, I guess so. Let me know and I'll implement it and move the threads there from the regular Vault.

On the naming convention, I think that's an annoying stipulation. I've been keeping track of the de facto names in the Records thread. There's no reason to force people into a format.

[Bloodcinder]

I implemented The Bag of Holding subforum to hold all of the old RP's. It also preserves the prefixes, unlike the Vault did.

[Gio Takahashi]

Nice, thanks.

[deathofcheese]

I'm signing up. NAO.

[llama_egg]

I did post a picture of myself. Look at my sig. D:

[Gio Takahashi]

Fail. Post a real picture of yourself. you know, what you look like behind the monitor?

[llama_egg]

Umm...errr...my cell is dead so I can't take a picture?

[Z]

http://www.unitedempire.net/forums/showthread.php?t=845 ! :D

[llama_egg]

All my mirrors are broken?

[Gio Takahashi]

Fail, eggs, fail.

DO IT BY ORDER OF THE GREAT JUSTICE

[SpaceProg]

Yeah, if *I* can do it... anyone can.

[DAMAGE]

Now that SB3 is over, SB4 will be starting soon.

[Bloodcinder]

There was a little bit of confusion about specifically what Tactics is. After clarifying it with DAMAGE, he has decided instead of doing Tactics to do a Custom Variant.

The game we are playing is exactly the same as Standard Snowbound but with the following rule extension: private communication among the living is permitted in addition to public communication.

The difference with Tactics is that the killers and medics will not know the names of their comrades and there are insomniacs.

So, keep that in mind, folks. We're playing Snowbound Custom Variant with added private communication.

[deathofcheese]

So it's just regular SB except with condoned private communications?

[Bloodcinder]

Yes: among the living inside the inn.

[Gio Takahashi]

There was a little bit of confusion about specifically what Tactics is. After clarifying it with DAMAGE, he has decided instead of doing Tactics to do a Custom Variant.

The game we are playing is exactly the same as Standard Snowbound but with the following rule extension: private communication among the living is permitted in addition to public communication.

The difference with Tactics is that the killers and medics will not know the names of their comrades and there are insomniacs.

So, keep that in mind, folks. We're playing Snowbound Custom Variant with added private communication.

very interesting, I think I like this one better.

[Bloodcinder]

It's very possible that this "simplification" of Tactics is better than the Tactics I have in Ed2. I might simply turn this custom variant into Tactics itself for Ed3...

[DAMAGE]

I am still waiting on DoC.

[deathofcheese]

Sorry, my bad. I didn't check the forums last night and I've been pretty busy this morning. Everybody I was waiting on to talk to about the stuff I'm making for them all decided to finally come see me all at once this morning.

[Z]

From BC via txt message:

Can't check forums 'til tonight... Spread the word.

[DAMAGE]

I've been running to the computer at work inbetween orders. So far there seems to be little public activity. I'm not going home tonight, so I will have to check things tomorrow if nothing happens before I get off from work.

As a side note, things are really awesome right now. I can't wait to see how things turn out.

[Bloodcinder]

Yeah, the majority of this game is probably going to happen privately, which is awesome. It's a nice spicing-up of the norm.

[DAMAGE]

I like how this game is turning out.

I'm going to try to think of another custom and secrete variation for future games.

[Bloodcinder]

Sorry I took so long. I woke up sick and then had to accompany the parents to the store and then had to take a nap before I dropped dead.

[DAMAGE]

No worries, I still haven't gotten all PMs yet.

As a side note, I think we should keep the tactics game variant, and name this variant "Alliances".

And I would like to stress that anyone outside or dead please not talk about any in game events. Please and thank you.

[Bloodcinder]

Do you really think so? I'm not sure if Ed2-Tactics is as good of an idea as this one. What merits do you see for it?

[DAMAGE]

Maybe it could use some more work, something like only the killers know each other.
Something like that and other changes perhaps.

[Killer_Man_]

Or that it's killers VS innocents.

[Bloodcinder]

We'll see what happens, but both of those suggestions would probably turn Tactics into Mafia. I'll try to see what I can come up with, but I agree that "Alliances" should be a defined variant in Ed3.

[DAMAGE]

Still at work, but also still waiting on JJ's PM.

[Z]

lol, such is the punishment for being loud and accurate. Avenge me, innocents! ;)

[Gio Takahashi]

I can honestly say that I saw this coming. You're a dangerous player to anyone.

[DAMAGE]

Kinda like last game, where I got targeted on the first night. Maybe I should not say so much in the beginning from now on, so I don't die so fast.

[llama_egg]

I hate you so much, way to not let me finish my defense post before closing the thread. I was getting ready to pretty much brake the game.

[Bloodcinder]

Eh, your defense post wouldn't have worked. [Face of smug but loving. Or smug butt-loving?]

[llama_egg]

Oh, I didn't care if it didn't work or not, it was the mere fact I was going to brake the game because Damage apparently thinks I'm blind.

[Bloodcinder]

Eh, well. Shhh. Don't break the rules, Mr. Dead Guy!

[DAMAGE]

I logged on.
Saw the vote had been finalized.
Checked to see if anyone else was looking at the thread.
No one was, so I closed it.

[DAMAGE]

Still waiting for JJ.

[SpaceProg]

DYNOMITE!

... Oh, THAT JJ... gotcha.

[chefTENGU]

Ron asked me to let everyone know that is laptop is on the fritz.

He described its state as "less than usable," so his access from home is probably going to be sporadic until he resolves the situation.

[SpaceProg]

Ah... I thought there was something amiss about the way he just popped offline. Oh well... :-/

[chefTENGU]

He updated me that he can now run it outside of safe mode, but I don't know how much progress he's made.

[Bloodcinder]

I no longer can run it outside of safe mode. Regardless, I have an acceptable Ubuntu live CD to run off of until I can get my (physically inept) system back to working order.

[Jasmin Jaquine]

I am sort of back, I think, pending that anything crashes either today or tomorrow. My apologizes for being mostly absent and only really getting my nightly things in to Damage. Accruals are done, just waiting for a few more items we're waiting for from DLR (*stabbity stabbity stabbit*) and we will be completely done.

[DAMAGE]

2 PMs left.

[Bloodcinder]

No worries.

[DAMAGE]

Hakuna Matatta!
Come onnnnnn.
<.<

[Gio Takahashi]

It means no worries,

for the rest of your days >_>

[SpaceProg]

It's a problem-free philosophy, y'all.

[DAMAGE]

Since I have to go home now, to a home with no internet cause I just moved, I will be unable to write the duel till tomorrow.

[SpaceProg]

I don't care. I'm dead again anyway.


:p

[Gio Takahashi]

That, I think was the best Mafia type game I've ever done.

Awesome, and nicely done Killer_Man_

[DAMAGE]

Are you ready to find out WTF was going on?


Night 1

[killer]Z pass
[killer]Gio pass
[killer]KM pass
[killer]BC pass
[killer]SP targets jj unsucessfully
[insomniac]Llama see's no one
[medic]JJ aids self
[killer]Chef pass
[killer]DoC targets BC and misses

Night 2

[killer]Z dies / pass
[killer]Gio pass
[killer]KM Targets Z successfully
[killer]BC pass
[killer]SP targets JJ unsucessfully
[insomniac]Llama can't sleep and see's KM
[medic]JJ Aids BC
[killer]Chef outside
[killer]DoC Targets self unsucessfully =p

Night 3

[killer]Z dead
[killer]Gio pass
[killer]KM targets llama unsucessfully
[killer]BC targets sp unsucessfully
[killer]SP targets jj unsucessfully due to aid
[insomniac]Llama see's no one
[medic]JJ aids self
[killer]Chef dead
[killer]DoC outside

Night 4

[killer]Z dead
[killer]Gio targets sp unsucessfully
[killer]KM targets sp unsucessfully
[killer]BC targets sp unsucessfully fail to kill
[killer]SP targets gio unsucessfully
[insomniac]Llama outside
[medic]JJ aids self
[killer]Chef dead
[killer]DoC dead

Night 5

[killer]Z dead
[killer]Gio targets sp
[killer]KM targets sp
[killer]BC targets sp
[killer]SP targets gio
[insomniac]Llama dead
[medic]JJ dead
[killer]Chef dead
[killer]DoC dead

Night 6

[killer]Z dead
[killer]Gio dead
[killer]KM targets bc
[killer]BC targets km
[killer]SP dead
[insomniac]Llama dead
[medic]JJ dead
[killer]Chef dead
[killer]DoC dead


If you guys had throw out KM instead of Gio, BC would have won because Gio Chose scissors.

Gio: scissors
KM: Rock
BC: Rock

KM and BC tie and goes into a tie breaker.
KM: Rock, Paper then Scissors
BC: Rock, Rock then paper

KM is the victor.

Everything in the game was left to chance. Percentages and everything. I wanted the duel to actually be kind of like a duel between the players. So I just decided on rock paper scissors.

Sorry BC. But if it makes you feel any better... Your strategy was awesome.

[Gio Takahashi]

Geez, seven killers to only two innocent. that's nuts but a lot of fun.

Also, lawl at this:

[killer]Z dead
[killer]Gio targets sp unsucessfully
[killer]KM targets sp unsucessfully
[killer]BC targets sp unsucessfully fail to kill
[killer]SP targets gio unsucessfully
[insomniac]Llama outside
[medic]JJ aids self
[killer]Chef dead
[killer]DoC dead

[killer]Z dead
[killer]Gio targets sp
[killer]KM targets sp
[killer]BC targets sp
[killer]SP targets gio
[insomniac]Llama dead
[medic]JJ dead
[killer]Chef dead
[killer]DoC dead

SP has been one tough Behemoth to kill.

[DAMAGE]

BC was the only one to get close to knowing there were a lot of killers. He manipulated all the killers to kill who he wanted. And made them think he was either a civilan or a medic.

[SpaceProg]

Holy Crap. That's all I've got to say.

[Gio Takahashi]

That he did. I thought there were four, then five....

[Gio Takahashi]

Friday got REALLY busy for me, and I had some plan to deal with BC in the long run, but like they say you snooze you lose.

[SpaceProg]

I am tough to kill. Hey look, I'm alive again.

[deathofcheese]

Well, so much for my thinking I was being crafty, inadvertently framing chef for an attempt on BC. DAMAGE out-craftied us all!

I really want to say again, kudos on all the cast-out posts, Damage. Especially the ones with me. Losing my pants and then llama losing his pants made me laugh so hard even after seeing it multiple times.

And kudos to BC, for playing us all as hard as he did. Alas, he didn't come out in the end due to bad chance, but he masterfully manipulated everyone like we were all his marionettes.

[Bloodcinder]

I had alliances individually with Chef, Z, SP, Gio, and KM. Betraying Chef happened because I truly thought he was the one who tried to kill me. Z lasted less long than I wanted him to. The other three... yeah, I played you all against each other. I had some idea that SP would discover my ploy sooner, so I tried to make sure she was the first to go. Other than that, the reason Gio got expelled instead of KM is that KM was online and Gio wasn't.

Doc lied to me, and got expelled for it, justifying my post of epicness. Do not... fuck with me. [Face of LORF.]

JJ and llama simply stood in my way as innocents.

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't pissed with the outcome. Then again, my original post of epicness stands. I'm the de facto winner by knowledge/strategy whether I survived or not.

One thing about this game has led me to consider something for the rules. I rather like the idea that the killers vie for their kills by RPS. In the case of a god-rolling host, it can still be faked, but in the case of a genuinely rolling host, it shifts some of the randomness back onto the participants themselves. I may work up either a variant rule or a change to the rules themselves for Ed3.

[Z]

BC was the only one to get close to knowing there were a lot of killers.

Actually by about Day 3 or so, Chef, BC and I all knew. Admittedly, though, BC was probably the first.

BC had mentioned a while back that he was thinking about what it would be like to make an all-killer game that would be won of the basis of who figured it out first so it wasn't a totally foreign concept when we realized what was going on.

Fairly interesting game, though. Kudos to BC for his strategy which seemed to serve him very well and Kudos to KM for his RPS choices which seemed to have won him the game. ;)

[SpaceProg]

I had some idea that SP would discover my ploy sooner, so I tried to make sure she was the first to go.

You were very correct. I had sussed out what you were attempting the night before, and had planned on offing you the next night, but oh well. Hence my IM and PM congratulating you for playing both sides against each other, and it being well-played. Of course, that was before you, yourself got offed by the one guy we all thought wasn't a threat to begin with. I guess this should be a lesson to us all:

A bunch of killers can't get along.
and
Judge not by KMishness.

[Z]

I toldjoo!!! :D

Perhaps aiding an insomanic is the most wise. Because if I die again, I'm never helping you again even if I do screw up and misunderstand the rules.

For some reason, I have a hard time believing you. I'm not going to accuse you today but I've never seen you subtly claim a role with such definition before. Usually it's just "You guys will be sorry if I die" or something.
Hard time believing me eh? Have you ever seen me successfully lie to any of you? It would be foolish to lie since I would only be caught.
As I said, today I am not going to accuse you. By that same token, I don't trust you enough to protect you (as likely no one does yet) so either you're telling the truth and will probably be dead tomorrow or you're lying.
lol, such is the punishment for being loud and accurate. Avenge me, innocents! ;)

[chefTENGU]

Heehee. I thought I was going to be spending a very cold night outside so I arranged a hit before I got expelled.

:D

[Killer_Man_]

So there was a lot of killers and BC lied to me... Sorry BC I had to use you to get everyone out of the way and had to backstab you. I just had to. Espeically since last thread I told you all. Mock my words, I will win at least one game. RPS choices. I usually chose that. At least one of them would have made me lose, tie or win. Depending on the other person.

Regardless, it was an interesting game. And yes, I'm surprised I didn't get thrown out after I killed Z but I had a lot of people fooled I was the insom.

Gio, BC and everyone applauded me for such a good naive effort.

[Z]

Mock my words
We usually do, hehe :D

[SpaceProg]

Let's rein in the egos, folks. Remember we were all at the mercy of chance this time.

[llama_egg]

That's one of the reasons I dislike the whole open discussion thing, it no longer feels like "Oh em gee, who's gonna stab me", but more "Oh em gee who can I backstab". Personally I find it takes half the fun from the game, as their is no longer a point for medics or insoms, hell, I was an insom and there was no point for it. Everyone just follows like sheep, and in the end it just revolves around whoever is most "popular" in the game.

Just my two cents.

[Z]

*shrugs* I like the private communication just becuase it added an entirely new aspect to being a killer and being able to coordinate your actions and influences. I honestly wouldn't mind seeing it done again but in a setting where the role ratio was more balanced.

In this scenario (where 7 out of 9 people were killers) there was no choice but to backstab whereas in a balanced role ratio'd game, that would not be the case becuase innocents would truly have the majority and wouldn't profit from killing other innocents.

[SpaceProg]

... You know, I have to agree with the Llama. Even though he eats my food with his nom nomming.

[Bloodcinder]

(I self-censured my last two posts for obvious reasons.)

Yes, I agree with Z, as per what I told llama in my karma-comment to him. I think that if there were few enough people to have a normal game ratio, private communication would be good.

This game was good, but I'd never knowingly participate in the same setup again. I think it's more of a novelty than a repeatable scenario.

[llama_egg]

That's completely my point, there was no point for me to be an insom during the game, I was contributing nothing, nor did I have a reason to be there, so in reality, it managed to completely brake the game.

Also, the reason I dislike the whole private communication is due to the fact it's tailored towards helping the killer, but nobody else. I dunno, it seems to, in my personal opinion to remove part of the charm from the game.

[Z]

lol, darn him and his om noming! :D

Well, like I said, I wouldn't mind it if it happened again [with balanced roles]. It makes for a tougher game because then you have to compare the facts with the influences. By that same token, the killers (and I would only advise 2 or 3 in a game of 9 or less) if they were ever able to identify one another, could coordinate their attacks on the innocents with more precision.

However, I do have to admit, deception plays a far bigger role in private comm games rather than public comm games but even then, if you accuse a killer in a public game, he will either have to lie to have his butt or get expelled. Either way you play it, a killer's survival will rely and his or her ability to deceive.

((Wowza, ninja'd by two posts! I have to type faster! haha :D)

[llama_egg]

Llama's amazing catch phrase! om nom nom.

While I agree that in the end, a killer has to lie his way through, I find that with private communitcation he is able to lie as well as make people believe him to a much farther extent. For example, he lists himself as a medic, well, this explains why he would be seen at night, as well he is able to lie easier by saying "Well, I was trying to protect X".

I dunno, I find it works better the CV then it does with Snowbound.

And yes, om nom nom

[Z]

True, I guess I just don't see that as a bad thing. Other than this game, the only killer to have survived until the end was chefTENGU which should be a testament to the fact that a killer victory in a balanced game is very hard to come by.

[DAMAGE]

I only did this because I knew that it would be highly un-expected, and I really wanted to F**k with peoples minds.

Did anyone read the duel before they read who won?

[Bloodcinder]

Did anyone read the duel before they read who won?
I did. I don't skip ahead when reading things as a general rule.

[SpaceProg]

I did too. The whole thing was like a twisted Agatha Christie novel. On dope.

Which is a good thing.

[DAMAGE]

The duel was the most fun part for me imo. I like this game mostly because it almost had to end in a duel. But then again I would have written something like that for pretty much any ending come to think of it.

BC: Your bandages can never heal a gun shot straight to the head!

[Killer_Man_]

Indeed, it was an odd game. Very odd.