Corporal Punishment in Schools

[Z]

http://cbs2chicago.com/investigations/corporal.punishment.cps.2.834123.html

[Summarized. Full story @ link]

CPS Takes Action On Corporal Punishment
2 Investigation Uncovered Beatings Of High School Athletes

CBS 2 Investigator Dave Savini exposed illegal corporal punishment in public schools, and the report is getting results that will help prevent children in our schools from being beaten.

The 2 Investigators uncovered the story about athletes beaten at Chicago's prestigious Simeon Career Academy. Now more big name schools are under fire as more students come forward to report abuse.

"We are going to fire anyone who we find that does this," CPS CEO Arne Duncan said in reaction to security camera footage the 2 Investigators exposed of a Simeon coach beating athletes with a 4-foot paddle.

Nathaniel says a Marshall High School basketball coach repeatedly hit him and other players with a 3-foot long wooden paddle.

The 2 Investigators obtained confidential records written by a Chicago Public Schools investigator. They detail complaints about four other basketball players being hit with a paddle by a Marshall basketball coach.

One says he got "3 licks" for missing an assignment.

Now, admittedly, the story above is based on a circumstance where corporal punishment was used without consent of the school or of the parents.

However, would you ever consent to allowing a school to use corporal punishment on your kid? Do you think punishments should only be dispensed by the parents or should anyone hoping to shape a kid's future or correct his behavior be allowed to punish him/her?

Thoughts?

[Arainach]

There are plenty of ways to punish a kid without corporal punishment. What the parents want to do outside of abuse is their perogative, but I see no reason for it to exist in the schools.

[Seegtease]

Even though I wholeheartedly agree with corporal punishment, it has absolutely no place in schools.

When a child is spanked, if you discipline properly, should come running to the parent afterwards. It should never be done in anger, and it should never be done unchecked by the parents. Quite simply, I don't trust teachers to discipline my children in the way I want them disciplined. They also have nobody to go to after being punished for comfort.

It's a parent's (and specifically allowed family members) job to do it, and nobody else. My dad, in school, was once hit so hard with a paddle he had red welts where the holes were in the paddle, it even drew blood. That's not even acceptable at home. My grandpa basically went to his office and threatened to kill him. He probably could have sued him, pity.

[Gerrymander]

There are plenty of ways to punish a kid without corporal punishment. What the parents want to do outside of abuse is their perogative, but I see no reason for it to exist in the schools.

QFT

If teachers cannot control their classes without hitting the kids, they need to seriously rethink their profession. And often, behavioral lessons ingrained through ways that do not use physical violence are far more effective than otherwise.

[Bloodcinder]

BEAT THE CHILDRUNS

[deathofcheese]

I'm all for effective uses of spanking at home, but that's where it should be, at home.

Not only should it only fall to parents for corporal punishment, unless we revert to flogging or whipping at the post as judicial forms of punishment, but it should also be kept private. I don't mean that it should be a secret, unless corporal punishment (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporal_punishment) gets banned, but it shouldn't draw attention or interrupt other people who don't really care to hear it.

[Killer_Man_]

Even though I wholeheartedly agree with corporal punishment, it has absolutely no place in schools.

When a child is spanked, if you discipline properly, should come running to the parent afterwards. It should never be done in anger, and it should never be done unchecked by the parents. Quite simply, I don't trust teachers to discipline my children in the way I want them disciplined. They also have nobody to go to after being punished for comfort.

It's a parent's (and specifically allowed family members) job to do it, and nobody else. My dad, in school, was once hit so hard with a paddle he had red welts where the holes were in the paddle, it even drew blood. That's not even acceptable at home. My grandpa basically went to his office and threatened to kill him. He probably could have sued him, pity.

OFT.

Because of the fact my Dad had something like that happen where this one teacher actually hit and or choked my Dad. And it was over something like going to the bathroom. My Grandpa when he learned about this went straight to the school and broke the teacher's nose and told him, how do you like that?

[RonDo]

Boy I remember when I got the whippins at school. Whew..lit me up. Home is the belt, school is the paddle.

Best one was when I got whipped for calling a girl a butthole.

[Killer_Man_]

The problem is as well is not only at times did my Dad get punished via paddle, at times he came home and got the belt. But that is only if it was really his fault.

[deathofcheese]

My dad alternated between his belt (thick leather with notch holes all along it) and the "Board of Education" which was essentially any long piece of wood smaller than a 2x4.

[Killer_Man_]

Lol @ the board of education.

[Seegtease]

Best one was when I got whipped for calling a girl a butthole.
I'd probably ask my son if I had to have a parent-teacher meeting with him present, "well, was she?"

[dinowoman]

While I think parents should be allowed to use physical punishment within reason (especially with very small children who generally are not mature enough to respond to reasoned argument - they need something quick and effective to act as a deterrent), I think that by the time children reach school age spanking starts to become less and less effective. When I was a child the traditional cane had been abandoned in state schools, but teachers did still administer the occasional slap to the back of the legs. I was on the receiving end once. (I can't remember why. I was a terribly shy child and normally wouldn't have dared put a foot out of line so I can't imagine what I'd done to warrant it.) But I remember it didn't bother me in the slightest. So if corporal punishment is going to serve as any kind of deterrent, it would need to be fairly severe, but that would also mean it could cause some harm. So no, I don't think corporal punishment is appropriate in schools. And, as Gerrymander said, if a teacher can't keep control without resorting to hitting children, they probably aren't suited to the profession.

[Charlie]

I'm all for parents, and even grandparents (within reason) punishing the kids in that way. Any relative in charge of them, as long as it doesn't cross into the territory of physical abuse. If I ever found out anybody else even did so much as slapped my kid(s) on the wrist over anything, I'd do everything in my power to see a suitable punishment in return for them, if not just cut contact completely. Including, but not limited to teachers. In which case, it'd be "fire the teacher, or I enroll my child into a different school."

Lecture them on the importance of education, fine. Give them an F if the assignment permits, fine. Send them to the principal's office or call the parents, that's cool too. But if it goes further than that, there's hell to pay. And rightfully, there should be hell to pay. Unless you want to see more examples of society gradually losing control of their own children and making them grow up as "pawns in the system," anyway.

[Killer_Man_]

"fire the teacher, or I enroll my child into a different school."Either we are going to run out of teachers or your going to run out of schools.

It's a bit over kill to go that far, teachers should have some power. I know back in highschool this one kid punched this teacher a few times cause he laughed at the kid for being such an idiot. Then the teacher responded with the same in defense. The teacher taught the kid a lesson. Just because he was older or a teacher doesn't mean you can swing at him and expect him not to be able to touch you back.

Hell, Mr. Sedeska, my favorite gym teacher and as well was my home room teacher. He took crap from no one and stood within reason and law when he did anything to a kid. If you are going to act like an idiot, you'll be treated like an idiot. Especially what was funny when some kid tried to fight him. He got demolished then Sedeska dragged him the liason office so Sedeska could file charges.

[Arainach]

There's another issue here too: I agree that teachers should not be spanking/beating students, but this whole thing has been taken too far to the point where if a teacher so much as touches a student they risk a lawsuit; this has caused a dramatic breakdown in classroom discipline and is a huge problem.

[Killer_Man_]

There's another issue here too: I agree that teachers should not be spanking/beating students, but this whole thing has been taken too far to the point where if a teacher so much as touches a student they risk a lawsuit; this has caused a dramatic breakdown in classroom discipline and is a huge problem.

Agreed, tis why I posted what I did. A lot of the older teachers don't care anymore and tell the students if you so much hurt anther kid or me I'll show you what old dynamite can do. Besides what are they going to do? Fire him? He can retire before they fire. xD

A lot of the teachers I knew did break up fights or defended themselves or even other students when fights broke out. Then you have a kid screaming, "I'LL SUE YOU, YOU CAN NOT TOUCH ME!" They are all like, bring it on. There has been many cases brought to court as far as I know and the charges were always dropped cause they acted within reason.

[Gio Takahashi]

Here's one:

I used to go to this old christian school. It's a little old fashioned, where they teach kids in all grades, from kindergarten to 9th grade while I was there.

For the kindergartens, corporal punishments were actually used on the worst of them. I've seen it happen. No, it wasn't spanking or beating them, they were grabbed by arm and dragged away from the others and alone with the teacher to speak with them. That's generally normal, right?

Every female teacher has done it and they got away with it, but I recall one of the male teacher that did it actually got arrested for it for "child abusing". The school was actually all over the local news for weeks afterwards all over that.

[Killer_Man_]

That's odd and if I went to that school I would have called the news/paper about how the women did it but a male does it and it's wrong.


Though I remember being grabbed like that all the way up to 8th grade. I didn't see anything wrong with it.

[dinowoman]

this whole thing has been taken too far to the point where if a teacher so much as touches a student they risk a lawsuit
I agree that things have been taken too far these days. I work with pre-school children and we have to be ludicrously careful to be sure that nothing we do could be misconstrued as abuse. Obvously we aren't allowed to use physical punishment or any kind of rough handling, but I think the guidelines advise against any unnecessary physical contact, and some settings have decreed that their staff shouldn't even be allowed to give a child a cuddle if they're upset, for fear of it being misinterpreted. When dealing with small children, that's totally ridiculous. Small children need the reassurance of appropriate physical contact to help them feel emotionally secure. By denying them that for fear of being accused of physical abuse, they're getting dangerously close to emotional abuse.

And the fear of being sued for abuse is even worse when dealing with older children. With the age group that I deal with, lawsuits would only be a danger if another adult saw something which they objected to. But as children get old enough to start to learn about their rights, some will try to take advantage of that and make accusations against the teacher, which it can be hard for the teacher to disprove.